<html><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><br><div><div>On 29 Mar 2009, at 9:00 AM, CACIM wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: verdana; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0; "><div style="padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 15px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; line-height: 17px; ">My main remark is that an ecosocialist declaration should absolutely link the climate crisis to the worst and deepest business crisis since 1929. This is a key condition if we want to get some influence among the workers and the poor in general.</div></span></blockquote><div><br></div>Yes, but the relationship is that 'green taxes', carbon trading, etc. result in transfers of wealth to the rich. The economic crisis hit because workers simply couldn't acquire more debt.</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br><blockquote type="cite"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: verdana; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0; "><div style="padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 15px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; line-height: 17px; ">We should explain that the combination of both crisis opens a totally new situation.</div></span></blockquote>What is the difference between the 'global warming crisis' and the 'oil crisis' recently and in the 1970's that capital used to justify massive transfers of wealth?</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><blockquote type="cite"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: verdana; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0; "><div style="padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 15px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; line-height: 17px; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="color: rgb(20, 79, 174); font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-width: -1; ">Rich economies have to reduce their energy consumption by 50% or more. Such a reduction can not be achieved only by better energy efficiency: a certain “de-growth” of material production and consumption will be necessary. </span></div></span></blockquote><div><br></div>A sure loss of support from workers and the poor.</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>The first step in any political action is seeing thru the propaganda of the ruling class:</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><a href="http://mises.org/story/3283">http://mises.org/story/3283</a><br><br>there is in fact no consensus of scientists behind global-warming:<br>Professor Dennis Bray of Germany and Hans von Storch polled climate scientists to rate the statement, "To what extent do you agree or disagree that climate change is mostly the result of anthropogenic causes?" … They received responses from 530 climate scientists in 27 countries, of whom 44 percent were either neutral or disagreed with the statement…<br></div><div><br></div><div></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>Suppression, etc. are summarized here:<br><br><a href="http://www.marxist.com/global-warming-socialist-perspective-part-one.htm">http://www.marxist.com/global-warming-socialist-perspective-part-one.htm</a></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>Actual measurements of the Planet's energy balance hardly make an appearance in the media:<br><br><<a href="http://www.signonsandiego.com/uniontrib/20060824/news_lz1c24moon.html">http://www.signonsandiego.com/uniontrib/20060824/news_lz1c24moon.html</a>><br><br>Reflected earthshine reveals changing global climate and clues to seeking other Earths<br><br>"From the middle 1980s to about 2000, they found that there was indeed a drop in the Earth's reflectance – enough to have increased the average amount of solar energy absorbed by 3.5 watts per square meter, a startling 1.7 percent increase.<br>By comparison, human emissions of greenhouse gases have added only 2.5 watts per square meter to the amount of energy retained by the Earth, Goode says.<br><br>Then, in 2000, the trend reversed. Earthshine increased, and the amount of sunlight reaching the surface began declining – an observation subsequently confirmed by data from orbiting satellites."</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br>dss<br><div><br></div></div><div>David Stodolsky</div><div apple-content-edited="true"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div><div>david.stodolsky@socialinformatics.org Skype: davidstodolsky</div></div><div><br></div></div></span><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></div></span><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></div></span><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></div></span><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"> </div><br></body></html>